63 longbed fleetside

Discussion in '1960-1966' started by audioclass, Aug 12, 2006.

  1. audioclass

    audioclass Member

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    First of all, hey there everyone, this will be my first post on these forums, so what could be better than starting it off with some questions.

    I have a 63 C-10 fleetside with a longbed. It currently has a 283 v8, but I'm most likely going to swap in a 350 crate engine. My first question is: In terms of dimensions, how similar are the 283 and 350? The main reason I'm wondering is because the truck currently has a small diameter signle exhaust which was installed by the old owner. I am going to be looking at a 2.5" dual exhuast for the 350, but it would be nice if I could get the exhaust done beforehand. So my question is, if I install a new exhaust system, headers-tailpipe on the 283, will it mate right up when its time to swap the 350 in?

    Second question. The 350 I am going to have built will pass the 400hp mark. I am looking to go with a 700R4 transmission, and either a 3.89 or 4.11 ring&pinion swap for the rear-end. Also added will be a limited slip differential. My main question is, what sort of power can the stock axles handle? Its a 12-bolt. At some point in the future I want to do a complete disc brake conversion front and rear, going to 5-lugs, but I hate to spend the money on new 6lug axles NOW if I am going to have to replace them again at a later date when I change all to 5lug.

    Ok and the last question. I know I will need to shorten the driveshaft, at least from what I have read about installing the 700r4. Anyone give me an idea on roughly how much it would cost to have it shortened and install new ujoints?

    Thanks for the help!
     
  2. 62 short step

    62 short step Member

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    So far as the engine goes, you can put the 350 right in the 283s place. Everything should fit fine. I think your rear end should be fine, should handle 400 hp. Not sure on the price on drive shaft. By the way welcome to the forum! Jeremy
     
  3. aimless

    aimless Member

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    A 350 will drop nicely in the place of the 283. But I am not 100% certain that the headers of both motors are the same (meaning your exhaust might not mate EXACTLY.) But I am certain that there is not SO much variation that it cannot be done. I put a complete exhaust system on my '65 when it had a 250ci I-6, running a split manifold for true dual. When I dropped in the 350ci with headers, some measuring, cutting, and slight bending of the exhaust pipes was all that was required.


    Unless you plan of pulling the front wheels off the ground, you should have little trouble with your stock axles. But when you do your ring and pinion swap, inspect the axles for possible problems with their integrity.

    A drive shaft? Hmm, depends on where you go. :)
     
  4. audioclass

    audioclass Member

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    Well Hooker lists their competition headers as the same for all small blocks from 265-400. So I was assuming that they should mate up. I was more concerned about potential width and/or height differences that would put stress on the pipes themselves.

    Good to know about the axles, I will definitely check them out during the r&p swap. I'm not planning on lifting the front end any time soon, maybe some day.....haha

    Also I'm not looking for a brand new axle, I was hoping to have my existing machined down to length. I'll just have to do some shopping locally I guess.
    ------------------------

    Another question, anyone have experience installing a 700r4 themselves? Bowtie Overdrives seems to think that their TV Made EZ program can let even a novice correctly adjust the TV cable. So anyone with experience in the area, how difficult was it to do? I've heard too many horror stories and I want to make sure I do it right so I don't burn up a brand new tranny.
     
  5. 62 short step

    62 short step Member

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    The 283 & 350 block are the same size externally. Jeremy
     
  6. drabo

    drabo Member

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    As far as you headers go all gen I and gen II small blocks are the same.

    I spent around $150.00 to have the drive shaft shortened, new U-joints and have bothe pieces balanced. If you are planning on having all that horse power under the hood the stock drive shaft might give you problems. Most of the drive trane is only good up to 400hp.

    The 700R4 swap was pretty easy. Check out some of my old posts on the 700R4 swap. Bowtie Overdrives has a lot of good info on the subject. But they are also quite proud of their products. Since you are planning on so much motor you might want to stick to a T350 or T400. Or you might want to consider taming down your engine build. Check out this site for a tranny to fit your needs.

    http://stores.ebay.com/Mad-Dog-Transmissions

    Also you might want to upgrade the brakes before yoou stick all that motor under the hood

    Good luck.

    Brian
     
  7. audioclass

    audioclass Member

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    Oh brake upgrades are soon on their way. I'm not planning on running it hard with the drums, lol.

    What are the advantages of going with a 350 or 400 over the 700r4? Also thanks for the Mad-Dog link, looks like he does some nice work, and can't beat the prices he offers.

    I'll look into a driveshaft upgrade, I was hoping to take the easy way out and re-use the original, but I want to make sure everything gets done right. As much as it can be anyway.
     
  8. drabo

    drabo Member

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    The T350 and T400 are know to be a stronger transmission. But it does look like MD Lou can make a 700R4 to fit your needs. You can't beat the fuel milage you get with a 700R4. The nice thing about MD is he dosn't sell a transmission he doesn't have. I ordered mine on a friday and was picking it up on wensday.

    I ordered the lock-up kick, bolts, and cover from Bow Tie Overdrives. I also ordered my speedo gears from BTO.

    The transmission crossmember and mount I got from CPP. It comes black powder coated and fits like a glove.

    I ordered the kick down cable and dipstick from MD Lou.

    I still need to replace my cooler lines. I just reused them and they leak. When you remove these lines make sure you use a tube wrench or you'll be sure to round off the nut.


    Good luck

    Brian
     
  9. audioclass

    audioclass Member

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    As far as the transmission goes, will he be able to tell me everything I need to get it going? I don't want to buy stuff I don't need, and forget to buy things I DO need. Also, how interchangeable are the parts? Like BTO's TV made EZ gig, would that function on MD Lou's transmission? I'm new to all this, so I'm trying to figure stuff out as I go along, but I don't necessarily want to learn from costly mistakes, so any babying along the way would certainly be appreciated.
     
  10. drabo

    drabo Member

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    MD Lou and BTO parts are interchangeable. Give Lou a call and he'll get you started.
     
  11. audioclass

    audioclass Member

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    Ok, another question. I'm looking at jegs to order the re-build parts for posi for my rear end, I'm only seeing compatibility with 64-up carriers. Is there something different about the 63 rear-end as compared to the 64, or will the parts still work? I need 4.10 gears and a good posi unit for a 63 12-bolt. Any recommendations on where I might be able to find these?
     
  12. 62 short step

    62 short step Member

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    Try Randys ring & pinion. http://www.ring-pinion.com/
     
  13. drabo

    drabo Member

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    You probably have 4:10 gears from the factory.
     
  14. audioclass

    audioclass Member

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    I honestly don't know what I have. I tried to check the axle codes the other day but its loaded with road grime and stuff, so I need to get out there with a wire brush and look it up. If they are already 4.10 thats great, I can just buy a posi unit, and maybe spend the money I save on gears for some new axles or something.
     
  15. drabo

    drabo Member

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    Make one complete turn with the tire and count the number of times the drive shaft turns. This will give you a rough estimate of the gearing.
     
  16. aimless

    aimless Member

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    You have to open the rear end cover to actually do this, but there are some numbers stamped on the ring gear itself. My current ring gear is stamped "XXXXX 41 11." That is the number of teeth on the ring and the number of teeth on the pinion. Divide the two numbers. 41/11 = 3.7272727. I have 3.73 gears.

    This is a good way if you want a specific answer as the old axle tubes often have the numbers rubbed off them, or no numbers at all, or if there is a possibility that the rear end was re-geared at one point already. The only problem with this method is that you need to crack open the rear end, and you'll need to get a new gasket and reseal it. If you'd rather not go to the trouble, do what drabo suggests. Make a mark on the tire and shaft so you know EXACTLY where one full rotation is.
     
  17. audioclass

    audioclass Member

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    Alright, so I decided against the 420hp beast i wanted to get, and went for something a bit more tame, more affordable, and a little easier to rest with. I noticed one of the members here purchased a ZZ4, seemed to like it. I talked to a bunch of people who all also recommended it, so I went ahead and ordered the turnkey build today, should be here in a week. I'll take pictures during the swap process and such. Also, I came across a used 700R4 which I was able to pick up for the amazing price of free. Talked to a few people at a car show, as well as some family members in the know and found a place Prince Racing, who will build it up for me. He can also shorten the driveshaft and do the new u-joints and such for me. Did a little dismantling and researching with the help of my uncle. I do indeed have 4.10 gears in the back already, so I ordered and Eaton posi-unit and will be installing that soon as well.

    Anyone who has done work with the differential, am I in for a headache seeing as I haven't worked on a rear-end before? I'll have my uncle to help me, and he knows what hes doing but I want to be prepared I guess, haha. Any troubles you ran into along the way, please share.

    B&M shifter also on the way for the 700R4. I guess the tranny guy I'm going to is an expert with the 700R4, so the TV setup shouldn't be an issue. I just need to buy a new crossmember now.

    Anyway, wish me luck, thanks for the help guys.
     
  18. aimless

    aimless Member

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    Make sure your backlash is good. Watch out for tightening down the pinion. Too much and you'll bust the seal. Then you got to start all over . . . if not you get a really nice whine on decelleration.
     
  19. audioclass

    audioclass Member

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    Ok I had a question about this but I forgot about it until reading your response. With the backlash, do I need to get a special tool to set it or can i just use some sort of shim to get the spacing right? If its too difficult I might just bring it somewhere to have it done because I would rather spend the money to get it right than save money and mess something up.
     
  20. dvalentine

    dvalentine Charter Member

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    I would rather spend the money to get it right than save money and mess something up.

    Good thinking. If you don't have the tools, and YES, some specialized tools are needed, AND you have never done one, then take it to a professional. If they screw it up, you can at least get it fixed at no cost.
     

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