So I got some of my patch panels delivered from our host today and as I was looking at them I thought - would it really be that hard to cut out the bad sections and weld in the new ones? Would I really need to pay a body shop to do this for me? Now when I ask that, keep in mind that I would need for all of you to tell me what type of welder to get cause I don't even know that, but I used to be a general contractor and also had a cabinetry shop prior to going into insurance. I feel I am good with my hands and I don't feel intimidated by the task. I am just wondering if I am biting off more then I can chew???? The one thing I found about construction and cabinetry is that it always seemed to be the same basic principals but applied differently. This seems similar but instead of wood you are working with metal - just different tools right???? So for those of you who have been doing this for a lot longer then I have, do you think this is something I can take a crack at and if I do, what do I need to get started???? I don't expect a welding class but knowing the basic starter tools would be a good help and any good tips would be appreciated too Steve
Here's some food for thought. Go down to your community college and take a basic course in welding. That will give you some hands on training and it will teach you about the different kinds of welding machines and which machine is the best for your applications. Welding isn't that tough, you just have to know a little about metallurgy and temps, tips and tools.
I have to agree with Ken. By heading to a CC would be your best bet. Its still on my list of things to do. Learning to do basic welding is actually easy to learn but to master welding and everything needed to understand metals and how to work them is another matter entirely. I would say the best all around welder would be a MIG but also like Ken said knowing you're needs will help you on this.
A wire feed (mig) welder would be the best choice IMHO for sheet metal welding. While you are at it,get yourself a flanging tool to make those patch panels virtually disappear
Welding with elektric , TIG or MIG Buy a good welding apparatus with a wider amp. range , a moore expencive welding mask is worth all your money. I have bought one lately from ESAB , they sell very good aparatus to. My experiences with the different apparatus gives different results but there good fore each purpose in there ranges. I like the TIG very much with gas and use it fore allmost everything. My son uses the MIG with gas for point welding when doing steelplate 3-6 mm. A basic course is good to have , practicall training at home using different metal profiles or steel plates is even better. Welding inside compared to outside gives different results. Inside welding with stable temp. and airco. is good. When having a project truck like the one you have i would considder to blast the steel constructions and plating clean. I did that with my own and welding became a very easy job that way. Beware of the fact that some of the old steel qualety is quite soft on these trucks, it needs sufficient cleaning and it must have a good surface to give you good results. Good luck Martinius.
send picts of the area to be repaired and the panels.taking a class is a good place to start if you have no experience with a mig. i can send you a p.m with my cell phone number if you'd like and help you through it . let me know Bobby
Welding newbie Go for it. Mig welding is not that hard. Save the time and money forgoe the class at the community college. It will be WAY too much information for just doing patch panels on your hobby truck. Get a wire feed mig...WITH GAS. Don't use flux core wire. If you are only doing sheetmetal patch panels, you can get one really cheap that runs on 110 volts and is more than powerful enough to weld the sheetmetal nicely. Flanging tools are nice, but they make these really nice butt-joint clamps that hold the panels together and leave just enough space to take the welding bead. Go slowly so as not to overheat and warp the panels. Tack the patch panel at various points along the butt-joint that is now clamped together. Then slowly weld SMALL areas in between the tack welds. Space them apart to minimize warping and to allow the panels to cool. Start at one end. Weld a small area between the tacks. Go to the end. Weld a small area between the tacks. go to the middle. Weld a small area between the tacks. Have an adult beverage to allow panel to cool a litltle. Do some more. The name of the game is slow and easy. Get some sheet metal to practice on or an old fender. Once you get your heat settings right and with those nifty little butt-joint clamps, you should be a pro in no time at all. Finish the weld by grinding it flush with a flap disc. It's less agressive than a griding wheel and gives you more control. Have fun, Andy
Thanks for everyone's reply BUT which name and model should I buy? Hey Everyone, Thank you for giving me ideas, answers, etc. however the one tidbit of info I am really lacking is what name/model number welder should I buy. I have got some advice from a guy here locally that welds and according to the machine he things I should buy I will be no less then $1000 into the equipment and then I still have to do all of the work. By the time I spend that, the question is could I just pay someone else to do the work? Anyway, some additional machine options would be great. I can look up pricing online but knowing the machines you have used and which ones would suit what I want to do would be greatly appreciated. Also would you recommend just a normal grinder with a metal cutting wheel and a steady hand to cut out the bad areas and make them ready for the new panels? Steve P.S. I will try and post some pics later this afternoon however it is all the usual suspects on the '54 3100 - the right rear outer and inner cab corner, the front right lower cowl (both inner and outer and the connecting piece between them), and the front left lower cowl
I use a lincoln Pro Mig 140 from Lowes. I use flux wire. It does all I have ever needed it to do, even frame work. It runns uround $500. Get some scrap iron, like angle iron and go stick it together. Crank up the heat to get the feel for it. See what it takes to burn through. Grap the welders handbook at Lowes also for reference. Now cut some pieces of sheetmetal and try welding them together. Turn the heat down and slow down the wire speed. Listen for a constant sizzle....like bacon cooking. Burn holes in the sheetmetal and practice filling them. Fiddle ith the knobs to see what they do, then find what works for you. To slow wire speed goes spurt-spurt- spurt. Too much wire will try to push the nozzle away. Just right fills the weld constantly, not too much buildup, but no cavities left over either. Too much heat gets holes quick, too little and the weld just sits on top and doesn't penetrate. Don't weld more than an inch at atime or you WILL get warpage. Spot the joints together and jump around, working in circle all the way around the joint, putting the next spots in between the last round of spots, until you have about 1/2 inch gaps, then weld a bead, skipping around. Thicker sheet metal is more forgiving, thinner will make your Tourette's act up. It isn't hard, just have to get the feel of it. Good luck.
i am in the exact same point in my project as you. welding is not hard as long as you are willing to PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE. different methods are better suited for different applications. MIG is easy and only requires one hand which can be a life saver in weird spots. TIG requires two hands, think soldering, but will give you smaller more maleable and most importantly beautiful welds. if you dont have the time to learn or do it right then by all means take it to a body shop it will cost less and be less aggrevation in the long run. they are just going to get everything close then smear bondo all over it so you are faced with quantity over quality debate but thats your decision to make. when you are learning you can screw up a million times on scrap but you only have one shot with you 50 year old rusted beyond belief sheet metal. i use an HTP dchf 130 with argon and a foot pedal. on the 20 gauge metal i use a 1/16 electrode with the gas at about 15 cfm. for the filler i go from er70s-6 or -2 and on bad pieces i use silicon bronze (SIB). for everything i paid about 1200 and compared to 3000 from lincoln or miller. i will post some pics to so you can get an idea of how things look with a tig. i hope this helps. robert
here are the pics. one is some of the rusted panels. i hand made the lower portion of the lower door pillar. i made the inner cowl. i hope these help. robert http://s213.photobucket.com/albums/cc128/rtnnhazel/truck/
Pics of the Usual Suspects Robert and Bobby, Attached are the pics of the rust damage. After seeing Robert's pics though I realize I actually have it pretty good being as the spots I show are really the only bad ones. The only other bad one is the right rear cab corner but I don't have pics of that yet cause someone repaired it at one time although did a very bad job. Steve P.S. Sorry the pics are sideways.
those spots are probably the most common. you just have to be careful when you dismantle these areas. once you take off the outer cowl you will see the real extent of the damage. and once you find it you have to get rid of it all or there is no point as it will just come right back over time. the most critical part is the door pillar. everything has to be taken apart and put back together in an order so just go slow and plan accordingly. i will try to keep my pics posted for you so feel free to ask questions about welding or metal fab. Robert
I couldn't do it on a customers vehicle but on my own project which doesn't pay anything anyway I still use the lost art of hammer welding. When done properly you can close your eyes and run your hand over the repaired area and not be able to feel the joint. Many times, with a bit of picking and filing, the only filler needed is a couple good coats of primer but if filler is necessary I use lead. VERY labor intensive and not practical anymore but just like to keep a bit of tradition alive. Some EPA types say it is not healthy but if they're still on the job when in their mid 70's I'll listen to them.
What do you guys think of this welder? So I recently discovered Eastwood. I was wondering what you guys think of this welder: http://www.eastwood.com/mig-135-welder-cart-helmet-kit.html Also what are all of your thoughts generally speaking about Eastwoods products? Since I am really new to this whole thing, your input is greatly appreciated. They have great videos and Jay uses them in his garage but what is the reality of their products and do you guys have other recommended vendors to buy paint, tools, and things of that nature? Steve
The body of that one looks very similar to the Lincoln. They may make them for Eastwood. Same general price point. Eastwood's stuff seems to be good quality, I haven't used any of their electrical products.
i never heard of them. i use miller machines at work and at home.thats my preferance.hobart makes a nice 110 unit. a good light duty unit up tp 3/16.used one at the race track a few times with no complaints.
coilover you must be a body man in the vein of Bill Heinz. The man is/was a legend and used lead every day.
i am in complete agreement with coilover. if i have sound metal i always to straighten it with a hammer and dolly. man i would like to find a body man that could shrink metal instead of just smear bondo all over it. i use lead quite extensivly but am considering using the lead free body solder from eastwood. coilover or anyone else, have you ever used this? Robert
I've been a welder for 30 years and have 13 certs. I've done several patch panels on various vehicles and the welder I have used at home for the last 18 years with no problems is a Lincoln SP 100 gas compatible with 75/25 gas. The 7/25 gas is good for sheet metal because it has less spatter. when welding patch panels it is very important to keep the metal cool. This is what I do and have had very good success.You want to make sure that all paint and rust has been removed from the areas to be welded first then Tak weld the panel in to place. Since fitting is critical to achieve a good weld with out a lot of heat and warping you want to make sure you have a close fit with minimal gaps. then you are gonna want to do some hammering and dolly work to make sure the two panels are flush with each other. It's better to have a bunch of Taks than one long continuous weld. What I do is keep the garden hose next to me with a spray nozzle on it. I skip around and lay Taks down then immediately cool the Taks down with water. watch the heat patterns on the metal and don't let them get too wide or you will warp the metal. keep laying Taks next to each other for about an inch then cool the metal then skip around to the other side. The important thing is to keep the metal cool. If the heat is right you will get good penetration. For grinding and cutting I like to use a 4" side grinder with a pearl disk for grinding and polishing and a cut off wheel for cutting. Good luck.... Big Tim
