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6 to 8 conversion

Chiro

Chiro

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A New York Yankee living in Virginia
Hi, I'm new to this site and new to my truck. I have a 55 first series with a 47-53 nose on it. It is an Old Navy truck and has been stripped of everything except rear and front axle and steering. I want to put a small block in it, preferably a 350/350 combo and a new rear. Any information about motor mounts, transmission cross members, late model ear ends that fit or other info would be incredibly helpful. Thanks
 
Chiro,

You can purchase universal engine and transmission crossmembers from just about anybody, how about Classic Parts of America? I believe a 70's chevy nova or camaro rear end is pretty close to the right track width of the truck.

Mike
 
Hey Big Mike,

Read your post about your truck. Seems like you have done an 8 cyl. conversion on your truck in the past. How about some more info about how you did it. Does stock steering get in the way? Want to leave the rest of the truck the way it is. I want to leave in the steering and front end as is. will put in a new rear, but need a little advise.
 
Chiro,

I'm doing the S-10 conversion to mine, but the rear end out of a 1998 and up four wheel drive s-10 blazer will work for your truck. It is 61 or 63 inches I forget, but I know for a fact that it will work. Also it will already be a disc brake setup. Most four wheel drive rear ends are also a POSI. Big plus in my book. The two wheel drive is 53 inches and would be to narrow for the stock frame, (that is what I'm using in my s-10 frame so I can tuck 20x10 inch rims). So make sure you get a four wheel drive rear end. As far as the motor mounts for mine is easy, everybody makes V8 conversions for s-10, but I don't know about your frame. I hope this helps.

Kevin:cool:
 
Chiro,
When I dropped in my first V-8, I removed the entire front end (sheet metal) and set it aside. I leveled the truck on jack stands, removed old engine and transmission, removed old crossmembers, placed the new engine crossmember in frame rails, placed engine and transmission (bolted together) on hoist and rolled it in, centered in between frame rails (crank shaft and transmission tailshaft), leveled engine, bolted engine to crossmember (c-clamp crossmember to framerails after engine is centered and leveled), c-clamped transmission crossmember to framerails, drilled holes in frame and bolted crossmembers to frame.

Once engine was in, I re-wired for the V-8, changed the radiator (stock radiator will not cool V-8 effectively), and installed gauges under dash.

The stock steering box hit the headers. I had to move the steering box back and out to clear, this of course changed the steering radius abit.

I used the stock 1950 rear-end (**disclaimer... I did this, it worked for me, you make your own choice**) I removed the torque tube and pumpkin, replaced it with a late 50's open drive line pumpkin. I set the angle the best I could and welded the axle perches (on stock 50's torque tube style rear ends, the axle floats on the springs, allows for drive shaft angles). I have used this set-up since 1985 and have not had any problems.

This what worked for me, if I would have had all the info that is available now, I might have choose different, but as I said, it worked for me. Take your time, measure, measure, measure and then measure again, nothing worse than a engine that is set wrong.

Do alot of research, ask alot (alot) of question and measure again!

Mike:)
 
Hey Big Mike,

Thanks for the info on how you did it. I really, really, really don't want to mess with the steering box. I was hoping that there was SOMEBODY out there that knows of the correct manifold or headers that will fit around the EXISTING steering box. all I hear is "it should fit" when guys talk about exhausting a small block around the stock steering. Summit Racing offers some "block hugger" headers, but I don't know if they will do what I want them to do. Nobody has given me a real solid answer on that issue yet. However, I am only JUST getting started on planning this project. I only just got the truck two weeks ago and am torn between returning it to stock or updating the drivetrain to 350/350. Really want to put the small block in it, but I just don't want to hassle with the steering if I don't have to.

Andy (chiro)
 
Chiro,look up a set of the old 55-57 smallblock ram's horn exhaust manifolds.
These should do the trick for you.
thumbs.gif
 
Hey Federale,

Found the Ram's horn manifolds new on Martel performance. They LOOK as though they could work!!! Do you have any experience with these manifolds working in the application I am thinking about?

Thanks,

Andy
 
Not in my truck,but I built a 51 Chevy sedan with a 327 more than a few years ago and they worked fine for that application. I have a Nova subframe in my 53 pickup so I didn't have any clearance problems with it.
 
Andy ;

Go to some car/truck shows and look under the hoods , take along a notepad and pencil so you can write down the important notes folks will give you , exhaust manifold casting numbers etc. .

FWIW , NAPA sells brandy new ram's horn Chevy exhaust manifolds , I had the catalog here but of course , some jerkoff on night shift stole it so I cannot post the part #'s :mad: .

_LOOK_ at a lot of old trucks as I know it's do-able with out moving the steering box , I'm an InLine man mysonself but I've seen and worked on lots of V-ate conversions since the 60's .
 
Hey Nate,

You will be happy to know (since you are the purist, I understand) that I am going to restore my '54 to original. Found a '54 rust bucket around the corner from me that has all the parts I need except motor and bell hosing/clutch assembly. Found a guy in the next state that is hod-rodding his truck and has a well running 235/trans assembly. Made both guys offers. Hope they take them because my budget is tight. This seems the easiest and cheapest and quickest way to go. Also since this is a project for my boys age 12, 11, and 9, it will be good for them because you know how the attention span of kids is. With the parts truck, and motor/trans assembly, this truck can be running in a very short time. I will be posting in the future about progress and your posts seem to be very helpful and knowledgable. I'm looking forward to hearing from you again.

Andy
 
Another Babbit Pounder !

O.K. Andy ;

Always remember : it's YOUR TRUCK so pay no nevermind to what old fogies like me say :D .

Take your time on this engine swap , look carefully when you take out the donor engine as the bellhousing motor mounts have cute little tubes in them that tend to fall out & get lost , no one has replacements then you get clutch judder....

Front mount too has a few parts easy to loose or forget , if at all possible , take pix with your digital camera of every thing as it comes apart , lay it out in order .

Engine should be de-greased & wire brushed to remove much old peeling paint and rust etc. , washed down with Ether(engine starting fluid)then painted _grey_ before insertion in the truck , acessories go gloss black , taking a moment to do this cleanup and re-painting on an old engine will result in a good looking truck once it's all back to-gether .

Firewall is body color and can usually be brought back to shiny & new looking by application of ' cleaner wax ' (Turtle Wax liquid etc.) .

I'm no purist ! I like 235 & 261 engines , 216 is O.K. but too slow for me - I speed across the Mojave desert too much to be able to keep a 261 to-gether

Grab the brakes off that junker '54 too ~ they're the improved Bendix brakes and you should be able to mix 'n match for a nice set of good thick drums , matching springs & hardware (important !) and so on .

SAVE EVERYTHING untill your truck is finished and driving , then you can sell off the old left over rusty , bent greasy bits to guys like me who still work these old rigs and recoup $ome of your $ invested .
 
Hi Nate,

Thanks for the wisdom. Been down the restoration road many times before, but it is always a welcome and rare thing to talk to somone with the experience needed to make the job a lot easier instead of learning the hard way. Another question for you. The guy in the next state who had the engine and trans assembly from the '54 may be selling the engine to another guy. I can still get the bell housing and clutch assembly with the trans, however. Same guy near me with the junker has a 1960 235 that runs well but "uses a little oil". I trust the guy. He has been a mechanic in town for a long time and has the reputation of being honest. He is also into restorations. The question is; will the 1960 235 work with the '54 bell housing and trans and will it all fit into my '54 with no problems? I have heard of plumbing issues regarding radiator hoses not working with later engines in ealier trucks. What do you have to say about that?

Thanks,

Andy
 
Making It Fit

Andy ;

As a farm/junkyard kinda guy , I tend to collect as many parts as possible them assemble it , rebuilding & repairing as I go along .
A _true_ '54 235 will slip right in and no long water pump hassles , down side is : one year only cylinder head if it cracks etc.

Either engine will bolt up to your bellhousing , you never know what flywheel & clutch you might have so it's always good to pop off the pressure plate and have a peek , use the lager diamter clutch & flywheel of course , rarely do I find the need to have the flywheel ground . most of the time replacing the pilot bushing in thew center of the crankshaft is wise , soak it in a coffee can of fresh engine oil a few days before insertion . to easily remove the egg shaped old pilot bushing , take a bit of wooden broomstick and whittle it so it slips snugly in the bushing , then pack the hole with bearing grease and insert the stick , give it a great fetching whack with a mallet and the bushing will be pressed out by hydraulic pressure ~ wear safety glasses as flying grease may enter your eyes , hurts like a bugger altho' I never experienced it , oh no :rolleyes:

Personally , I'd take the 1960 engine as it will have vastly improved oiling and the better crack resistant , high compression head on it to boot but either one will do .

Grab both and after cleaning up and making run (use wichever has higher compression for more power) you should be able to easily sell the remaining engine as a long block and then split up and sell off the acessoires piece by piece too .

As far as water hoses , it seems to depend on the height or the water pump , this varies over several years , I have a late 235 in my '49 with the original radiator and I used the stock hose listed in the Goodyear catalog....

All you needs do is ensure it's not kinked or collapsed and it'll be fine , it is allowable to trim radiator hoses .

Did I answer your question ? (doing 4 things @ once here)
 
Hi Nate,

I have no idea about what kind of tubes you are talking about on the Bell Housing mounts. The motor and trans are out of the truck in CT. How would I know what to look for or ask about when talking to the guy with the unit? Are the tubes something that fall out when the mounts are removed from the frame/cross member or do they fall out when the mounts are removed from the bell housing?

Thanks,

Andy
 
BellHousing Mounts

Andy ;

The mounts on the bell housing are held to the frame by one bolt each and this bolt passes through a little metal tube , it prevents the mount from compressing and / or distorting ~ when the engine is removed from the vehicle , they tend to drop out and get lost .

I suppose you could make new ones out of steel tubing from your FLAPS but I'd just ask the seller to please get an old hub cap or small box and toss in _all_ the old hardeware that he removes when removing the engine ~ tell him to sweep up and toss it all in , dirt , leaves & all , you'll sort it out later .

This is just one of those things where using the stock , 'just so ' hardware makes the job go so much easier , it's a simple thing to set up a cleaning bucket and wire brush , radio and cold beverage (ahem) , spend some quality time sorting & prepping your hardware in advance , planning how you're going to hoist that immensely heavy & awkward lump over the core support and into the engine bay...

Ask for the throttle rod too ~ it goes from the bellcrank through the floorboard and attaches to the back of the acellerator pedal , cannot be used in his V-ate conversion and Checy used _so_ many slightly different variations of these it's good to have a couple to choose from when updating from a 216 to 235 or just replacing the old nasty one for one that (!surprise!)
fits better and doesn't stick....
 
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