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235????

brit 50

brit 50

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Just about to start re-build of my engine but have some worries, Nate this is probably aimed at you but please anyone feel free to throw in their 2 cents.

My 235 ran when I got her, it smelt of old oil when running but didn't smoke or knock and seemed ok but I wanted peace of mind whilst on long journeys, so as I was stripping it down to a bare frame I tore the engine down too,

Found head gasket blown slightly, two end bearings were hammered, down to brass and had spread, crank seems ok but haven't miked it up yet, and the oil holes on crank are not chamfered, which concerned me as the edges of holes were ragged and tiny silver particles were embeded in bearing surfaces. Now there is a slight step at top of bores but its already at 60thou over and iv'e seen 80thou pistons for sale, ok to go this big?, crank is at 30thou. block is a 58' and has an 848 head.

Now, do I re-build this one? I have a lot of experience engine building wise including race engines and alcohol/nitro engines, but have never done one of these, nothing like the old jag xk engines I used to build many moons ago. Im an avid reader of the posts on here and have noticed people saying things like they don't like reving constantly above 3500rpm!!!!!, I want to do some freeway riding for 200 miles on some journeys so I got the 3.55 diff kit. And Im worried that maybe I should drop a later six camero type lump in, but I really like the idea of an ol' school sixer with twin carbs on an offy and either fentons or tube headers with straight thru's and a beehive, Im not looking to go street racing, just cruising on a freeway and pottering round some rod meets (ol' school 32 on drawing board for missus at moment) everything on truck is standard even the huckies! but iv'e got a boat anchor in back to throw out in emergencies!

Whats your experience/opinion on this one? e-mail me if your answer is too long for here [email protected]

Thanks guys from over the pond.

Neil
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Anal Sex
 
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Neil ;

The later 6 bangers use thinwall construction , good engines but not overly sturdy so I'll dispense with them for this answer .

Your 235 needs new cylinder sleeves , .080" isn't a good idea IMO .

If you've built hot rods , just do all the basic tricks of balancing , match porting , unshroud the exhaust valves & guides , CC & match the combustion chambers then have them polished to a shine , the usual stuff will make this excellently designed power plant sing like it should and it will then easily go the distance (it's allready 50 years old so you know the design is good)

Maybe a set of 261 rods or shot peening the original ones to help with the high RPM's .

_Balancing_ everything in the engine to _zero_ grams will make a HUGE differance in power and longevity .

The 3.55 ring & pinion will get you up to cruising speed but if you run tiny 15" or smaller tires , the engine speed goes up again..

I'd say you're on the right track .

I know there's quite a few old Chevy's being built up in England right now so maybe one has a good used 235 coming out you could use the block from...

The 848 cylinder head is the very best one , have new stellite valve seats installed and some decent silicone bronze valve guides too , those cast iron ones are sturdy but wear oval , allowing lots of oil to sneak past . use one piece valves too .

_DO_ cross drill the crankshaft oiling holes , again that wasn't being done when this engine was made but it'll help bearing life a LOT .

Find a _new_ 261 cam and solid lifters ,then a pair of cam gears , aluminum cam gear not that silly fiber thing ~ be sure to get both gears from the same manufacturer as some use ever so slightly different pitch on the teeth......

I hope this helps , you're going to LOVE this truck once the engine is done.

If you can find it , there's a good write up with templates for drilling steam holes in the head & bock like the 261's had .

Maybe over on The StoveBolt Page ? .

Find and old stock rope typ rear mail bearing oil seal and drop it into a coffee can full of engine oil now , to soften it up for easy instaaltion plus less dripping once installed .
 
Nate, thanx for the advice and I have a few more questions,

261 rods? am I right thinking that they would need machining for normal end bearings? is that the only work they need? are they worth the work, ie that much better.

also why the 261 cam? use 235 cam gears or 261?

whats the importance of the steam holes?

come to think of it Nate, just build me an engine and send it over! it would save you the head ache of me asking you all these questions.:D
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HENRY FORD
 
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261 Rods In 235 Engine

O.K. , I had several posts dissapear yesterday so this will be much shorter , sorry but I'm pi$$ed off about that .

261 rods fit right in place in a 235 , using the 235 bearing inserts , no machining necessary . 262 rods are re-designed to withstand continuous high RPM operation without stretching & breaking like 235 rods do .

The 21 camshaft is the camshaft designed for the '54 Corvette with 235 engine so it has a nice smooth idle but unlocks all the 235's potential , adding mulitple carburation and / or dual exhaust and the engine simply scream with tourquy power from 700 RPM's up till it goes " BANG ! .

Long , inline engines always have poor water circulation in the back of the block and get steam pockets so drilling the steam relief holes between head and block , allow the engine to run cooler all the time and more even cooling where it's most important . (long explanation here got lost in last message , wil wepost if you want)

I know there's a WebPage dedicated to this operation , sorry I'm not a tech head to know where nor how to find it .

I'd like a 261 too , I found an old P-van with one in it in the fence of one of the secret desert junkyards I shop at , theyonly want $250.00 for the entire drivetrain but I'm old & stiff dammit , not sure I'm up to overhauling an engine
 
Nate, you are a diamond geezer,(as we say over here), if you could just e-mail me the total contents of that knowledgable mind of yours, that will suffice, I have hundreds of questions for you about the 235 but I will just have to move over to the US and live next door to you I suppose! (joking, don't be scared)

Am I right in thinking that a long tube header would be better than short ones seeing as these old lumps seem to be more about low end torque than rpm and brake horsepower?

Shame your long post got lost, I genuinely have a thirst for knowledge about these trucks and everything about them and enjoy your posts.

Neil
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Granada (Europe)
 
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235 Service

Well ;

lessee if this works.

O.K. , that worked so I'll edit it and see if this is a workable workaround...

Anyway , do ask questions and I'll answer them as best I can .

I like to split stock headers and leave the restrictor plate out as that's only to make noise .

I guess the tube headers are O.K. but you'll never see them on one of my old babbit pounders .

As long as there's a crossover up as close to the engine as you cam manage , any split or dual exhaust will work well .

Moving the muffler further back (for those who simply _must_ have a muffler) also works out well , the muffler's life will be shortened tho' as it'll never get hot enough .

That's all for now , let's see if this posts .
 
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Damn truck, Im so hooked on it now, spent all day sunday traveling to and from a guy who has a 56 4door with a good 235 (except a little puff from the breather when hot) and beating him down till he agreed to part with the engine, forgot how many times I said "man, this would be awesome with an 8 in it!" gotta go an rip it out next week but at least it works out cheaper than re furbing my one.
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Vaporizers
 
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O.K. then ! you're on the road to wellness I see :)

Fentons are O.K. , not great . they require a certain amount of fiddling to make fit and should come with special stepped washers to properly hold them and the intake manifold to the head ~ the height of the thrust lugs is different
, unlike the height of stock exhaust & intake manifolds so you cannot use the hardened flat washers . use the heavy stamped washers like from a 230 CI 6-banger and grind to suit .

I bet that '56 235 will be a stormer once you get it in and properly tuned up .

When buying a running used engine , unless you're paying under $150.00 , a vacuum gauge and a compression tester is a big help and also serves as a lever , watching that vacuum gauge bounce around @ idle due to tight valves makes the seller really nervous and drops the price usually.....

" Oh hell ~ the valves are all warped ~ I thought you said this was a ready to go engine ? I'll give ya $75.00 bucks for it "........

Take it home and adjust valves , dwell & timing , clean out and adjust the carby and go drive it....

Some oil smoke out the breather or Road Draft Tube is normal in these engines , might just be old oil not changes for many miles...

Keep us posted .
 
Gave the old 56 a good run down the road before buying and it didn't miss a beat, has powerglide behind it so its had a reasonably easy life, and it's a real genuine old car, been well looked after, gotta say there are worse ways to spend a sunny sunday afternoon than floating round the English country lanes in a nice 56, far worse ha ha, had to hold back from buying the whole damn car! it was cheap too! but there was a nagging voice in the back of my head saying "dont be silly" sfunny but I heard the same voice when I got home saying "your late for dinner, where the hell you been" ha ha
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Suzuki tsx
 
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'56 Chevy & Split Exhaust Manifold

You passed a '56 Chevy with a 6 banger and Slip 'N Slide Powerglide ?! :eek:

You must be DAFT :confused:

New wives are to be had but not many unrestored '56s Stateside anymor e, they all got chopped ito hot rods and then scrapped (of course) in the 60's & 70's :mad:

I prefer the '55 myownself but what the hey , I'll prolly never afford one now .

I don't weld so I don't split the headers , I find older muffler shops and ask the oldest guy in there to do the job as welding cast iron is tricky , you gotta heat up the _entire_ manifold then blow the new hole in it then weld on the new outlet then cool is slooowwwwly in ashes or something.....

Most folks add a restrictor inside to make a true split manifold but that's to make it " rap " ~ noise . allowing the two sides to breathe to-gether adds mid-range power right where a long inline engine needs it most .

Go look at pictures of '54 Corvettes exhaust manifold , I see them on E-pay from time to time , nice but not worth $500.00 :eek: to me .

BTW : I know you're not going to junk SWMBO over an old car ! :rolleyes:
I'm lucky in that my Shirley lets me play to my heart's content , she knows I don't chase the ladies or get drink and crash my truck etc.

A few years ago I found my dream car : 1937 Chevrolet Business Coupe with '57 235 engine , unrestored , no rust , never hit , re-painted once , Granpa's old driver with FIVE different brands of bias ply 16" tires on it ~ would made a great driver / commuter , I mentioned it to her and she said " how much is it ? . - I had to say ' no honey , I have too many now ' :(
 
This old 56 was a real beaut, totally genuine un-butchered grandmas car, such a treat to drive it around the dappled sun lit lanes, all it needed was a touch of beachboys on the radio to make it heaven, oh yeah! and the wife sittin next to me of course, (looking over my shoulder at moment) Im not a big fan of 56's but it was just one of those moments in life when you forget the mortgage, the bills, global warming and bearded nutty religeous twits, and return to those carefree teen years, and think, yeah, this is what it's all about!

Nate you should have thrown caution to the wind and bought that 37, regret the things you've done, not the things you hav'nt! as some great mind, who I can't remember, said once.
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Masturbation Toys
 
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' Swmbo ' ?

?? :confused: a Brit who doesn't know Rumpole of The Old Baily Courts ?
Say it isn't true ! :p

It means :

She

Who

Must

Be

Obeyed

! :p

I looked hard at that '37 , it had the thin , old worn out key in the ignition (chrome and stamping worn completely off to the brass then polished smooth) and the counter man said
" sure Nate , it's open , go look under the hood , fire it up !"
two '37 hubbies , one '39 hubbie and a '41~'47 DeLuxe hubbie , 6 volts , had radio and heater , oh man lemme tell you ~ if I'da TOUCHED that car , it'd been with me forever...

I simply have NO parking space left :(
 
In the words of the great Homer, "D'oh". She who must be obeyed! how embarrassing is that, can I have cream with that large portion of humble pie? I would have parked the 37 on next doors drive and faced the music later!
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TOYS VIDS
 
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Where To Hide It ?

Aye laddie but therin lies the rub doncha see :

I live on a corner and the drunken b*tch who lives next door is the cause of all my code enforcement troubles..... :mad:

I'm 100 % leagal BTW , I had to go to court and prove that she and the code enforcement officer actually falsified evidence against me.... (he thought I'd give him a free car to go away ~ HAH !
 
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